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View Full Version : Ranged Hunter build in Chapter 3, epic and legenday?



Ieldra
07-24-2006, 05:29 AM
I'm looking for an interesting ranged hunter build. I've played an Avenger through chapter 2 normal but decided to stop playing her for now because I think she can't survive chapter 3 without a core dweller, and I don't want yet another character with a core dweller. Perhaps I'll return to her later.

So far the alternatives I count as "interesting" are hunting+spirit, hunting+storm and hunting+rogue. I'm confident I could make a build of each which can survive chapter 1 and 2 normal, but I'm worrying about the Tigermen and Draconian Deathlancers, as well as the higher difficulty modes. I'm not averse to running a lot, but what can I do when there's no space to run (%$!§-closed doors at the Minotaur's lair).

My thoughts so far on each build:

Hunting+Spirit: I would concentrate on the Deathchill Aura line and put everything else into Hunting (Wood Lore, Marksmanship and Puncture shot with priority). If I decide to start with Spirit, I would put some points into Life Drain and Ternion Attack but move them to Hunting later. The main question is: do I need a pet to survive in chapter 3 and later? I'd rather put even more points into Hunting, and either pet costs a lot. I could decide to go for the Outsider, but then I can't remove the mastery points should I decide I don't need that skill later.

Hunting+Storm: The obvious is to develop Storm Nimbus+upgrades along with Eye of the Storm - a great complement to a ranged hunter. The problem is: that costs quite a lot of points, so I don't expect to get a great benefit from it until halfway through epic. So, chapter 3 normal survivability is the main question. How should this character look at level 30? And again: do I need a pet at this point in the game?

Hunting+Rogue: I would develop the Envenomed Weapon line to complement the bow attacks, and later use Flash Powder to survive melee attacks. The main advantage is that I don't need to put points into Intelligence - I've had problems with attribute points with my Avenger. The question, again, is survivability in chapter 3 and higher difficulty modes. I won't have a pet, and I guess if there's an archer I didn't see early enough in legendary, I'd be dead. Then, there's also the trap skills which sound quite useful as they should draw the aggro as well as deal some damage. Only I guess in epic and legendary they won't cut it any more unless they get a boost like the pets do.

So much for my thoughts. Now I'd like some advice...

Frostbane
07-24-2006, 06:08 AM
My sage is level 18 and I have to constantly switch to spear or run around like a madman.

dangermeister
07-24-2006, 07:19 AM
I would recoment a Ranger (hunter/nature, i didnt se that one in your post correct me if im wrong). A ranger shines in many wais manly his wolfs who just get better and better when they get to epic and legendary. And u also have there Streangh of the Pack skill wich gives u attack speed and dmg (huge dmg and ASP). They eat pretty much everyting, normal will prob be a bit thougfer then epic and legendary, because u will be relying on your wolfs who will have to strugle in act3 a bit, but if u have a good bow that will not be any prob.

Good build:http://www.titancalc.com/TitanCalc.asp?mastery=Ranger&master1=4&master2=7&m1=32-0-15-12-0-10-0-0-1-0-0-0-0-0-0-12-0-0-1-0-0&m2=32-0-0-6-12-10-0-0-8-0-0-8-12-0-8-10-1-0-1-12-6-0

Ieldra
07-24-2006, 07:46 AM
I would recoment a Ranger
I'm playing a very Nature-focused Summoner through epic mode right now, and while it's very much fun (and rather easy most of the time), it is also enough Nature for me for some time. This is the reason the Ranger isn't in my list. I'd like to play something different.

dangermeister
07-24-2006, 07:56 AM
common lets be realistic, is it really possible to get enough of nature? :happy:

kennyepic
07-24-2006, 07:59 AM
This Sage build looks nice on the surface: http://www.titancalc.com/TitanCalc.asp?mastery=Sage&master1=7&master2=8&m1=32-0-0-6-1-0-0-0-0-0-0-1-1-0-0-0-0-0-6-1-6-0&m2=16-0-10-0-0-8-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-12-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0

As for a ranged Brigand, I have one at level 19. If you jack up your Envenom Weapon / Nightshade skills you can shoot most mobs once and move on...they'll probably die just before they can get into melee range. For some odd reason turtles were a problem for me. :confused: However, fighting undead always sucked...I usually meleed them. I know Brigand is a popular build, but specifically what kind of Brigand I don't know.

Ieldra
07-24-2006, 08:20 AM
@dangermeister:
Heh - nature isn't my friend until this summer has passed - it's getting hot enough to fry my plants as well as my brain where I live (maybe it's already fried - I wouldn't know, would I?)

@kennyepic:
That Sage looks interesting, but it brings me back to the question: can I do without a pet in late chapter 3?

kennyepic
07-24-2006, 09:10 AM
The tigers would probably eat you now that I think about it. :errf:

Armada
07-24-2006, 09:53 AM
The Brigand is very, very effective VS those tigermen and dragonians. The top tier poison confuse them before they reach you and they wander around aimesly so you can pick them down easy. i F#%()& LOVE poison in this game =)

Ieldra
07-24-2006, 10:08 AM
The Brigand is very, very effective VS those tigermen and dragonians. The top tier poison confuse them before they reach you and they wander around aimesly so you can pick them down easy. i F#%()& LOVE poison in this game =)
That sounds promising. Do you know anything about the effectiveness of traps in higher difficulty levels? Or if Lethal Strike works with a bow or only with melee attacks?

Armada
07-24-2006, 10:18 AM
"Do you know anything about the effectiveness of traps in higher difficulty levels?"

-they own ive heared, never tried them myself.

"Or if Lethal Strike works with a bow or only with melee attacks?"

I dont think they do, i havent put a point in it yet myself because i dont know it for sure.

Felexitus
07-24-2006, 10:24 AM
LS works with bows. as for traps yeah look around and watch us praise them

MiloDrama
07-24-2006, 10:25 AM
Lethal Strike does work with a bow. Really usefull to OS those casters and archers before they can hit you.

Ieldra
07-24-2006, 10:51 AM
OK. I think I'll try that Brigand. Sounds like fun (and no worry about Intelligence). That leaves one last question:

If I go the traps route as I'd like to, I'm going to be quite a few points short for maximizing all relevant skills in the Hunting Mastery. Which skills can I leave out, which are important?

OK, rather than listing everything and since I've just found out how to link to a build, what do you think of this build (http://www.titancalc.com/TitanCalc.asp?mastery=Brigand&master1=6&master2=7&m1=32-0-6-12-0-0-8-8-0-0-15-0-1-8-12-0-8-0-1-0-8-0-0&m2=32-0-0-6-10-10-1-0-8-0-0-1-12-0-1-1-1-0-1-1-6-0-0)?

Terrawen
07-24-2006, 11:54 AM
Hello, Ieldra

I see that you've passed on the Ranger. That's unfortunate, as it's the strongest archer combination in my opinion. Though I can understand your reluctance to go with Nature on another character.

The Brigand is a fine class combination, but it only truly shines in melee combat for reasons listed elsewhere. Looking at your build, it appears that you may have spread yourself too thinly.

For one, Blade Honing doesn't work with a bow, so I'd drop that.

Lethal Strike and a rank of Mortal Wounds are great skills and they do work with bows, but I definitely wouldn't recommend it. The reason is, due to the way arrows work in Titan Quest, you won't be able to consistantly and effectively take out the largest threat in any given group of enemies. The first target that your arrow smacks into is the target that will receive your Lethal Strike. If the largest threat isn't at the front of the pack, then you just overkilled a trash mob. Plus, at rank 1, Lethal Strike is hardly optimal.

I see that you've invested heavily in the poison tree. Poison is rather potent in Normal, but certainly won't be noticable in Legendary. Poison damage in general does not scale well through the difficulties and since you can't boost the damage percentage via attributes like you can with elemental damage, you'll start feeling the effects of diminishing returns rather quickly. I would completely remove Toxin Distillation and all but 1 rank in Envenom Weapon. you lose your meager poison damage but you keep your confuse/fumble/slow side effects.

1 rank of Herbal Remedy? I wouldn't bother. Even at rank 6, the value of this skill is very much debateable and highly specialized. It's potentially great with a high health regeneration Warden Adrenaline+Herbal Remedy combination, but otherwise it's definitely a low priority.

Flush Out is very much unnecessary for you. You don't deal elemental damage at all, so it's not boosting your damage. You can't critically hit with a bow, so decreasing your opponent's defensive ability is worthless. Remove it.

On the other end of the spectrum, I would recommend you use the skill points you just saved to raise up Study Prey, Exploit Weakness, Trailblazing and Find Cover. All of which are truly beneficial to you. Study Prey will decrease the damage and pierce resistance of your enemies, which means you do more damage. Exploit Weakness gives you a big damage buff and with enough -recharge equipment, you can make this buff permanent. Trailblazing means you run faster and without a good pet you'll be reliant on your run speed much more. Find Cover means you take less damage from arrows.

As a personal recommendation, I'd remove Flash Powder as well. A good skill, but very much melee oriented. The radius isn't amazing, so to effectively use this skill you'll need to be in the thick of combat. Not a good idea, generally. Use your mandrake/nightshade at range wisely and let your traps pull some agro for you. Use the points you spent in Flash Powder to raise up your attack skills; Marksmanship and Scatter Shot Arrows. I'd say your Marksmanship line is fairly critical to what you are. That is, an Archer.

Cheers and good luck.

Felexitus
07-24-2006, 12:13 PM
id mostly agree with terrawen here especially about rangers being the better archers

study prey: max, its prolly the best hunter skill but flush out isnt needed for a bow user

scatter shot arrows: 0 or max its only good when its maxed.

find cover: 0 or maxed. id advise maxing this

blade honing: 0 it doesnt work with bows

envenom weapon 1: poison damage isnt much especially if youre playing brigand.

toxin distillation 0: see above

now for the recommendations

lethal strike: 0 or max if you dont kill the opponents with it its a waste of an insane amount of energy
exploit weakness: max. improves scattershots, traps etc and makes call really worthwhile
marksmanship: 1 youll need the skill points and this is the skill that gives the least bang for buck



http://www.titancalc.com/TitanCalc.asp?mastery=Brigand&master1=6&master2=7&m1=32-0-0-1-0-0-8-8-0-0-15-0-0-8-0-0-8-0-0-0-8-0-0-0-0&m2=32-0-0-6-3-10-1-0-8-0-0-8-12-0-8-10-6-0-0-12-6-0-0-0-0

Ion Silverbolt
07-24-2006, 12:56 PM
If you want to fly through normal difficulty as a sage, crank mostly intelligence and focus on good crowd control. Lightning bolt + chain lightning freaking mops up large crowds. About the only investment in hunting I had was wood lore but the bow made a nice mop up tool for killing survivors of chain lightning. Also, Thunderball is sweet as well. Good for stunning mobs so you can get some breathing room.

Slowly pump up hunting, but keep the heast on with storm skills. Once you get eye of the storm and wisp, it's over for the bad guys.

Now and then just put a few points in hunting mastery then you can keep using newer bows if you don't want to invest much in strength.

Ieldra
07-24-2006, 04:42 PM
Thanks for the advice, everyone. The comments on poison damage are really welcome - these scaling things are exactly what I wanted to know. But I do worry about not having anything to add damage to my attacks. The Avenger I played did about 130 per attack at level 20 - good enough to kill small fry in one shot in Egypt, but the crocodile men took three to five shots. OK, they're slow to compensate for it, but the enemies don't stay slow. If I need to rely on traps and confusion and fumble effects against the Tigermen and Draconians, maybe it's important to focus on developing the relevant skills between levels 20 and 30...

Concerning Lethal Strike - how is it against bosses? I mean, real ones like the Minotaur and the Telkines, not just monster heroes. Taking a big chunk of life out of them in one attack seems very desirable, even if it doesn't kill them at once.

As for the Sage - I completely forgot about Thunderball. I see how the stunning effect would be very useful. How do you develop your attributes for a character like this? You need elemental damage, and you need Dexterity for your equipment, and if you start with Storm, you'll be most likely using mage equipment for quite some time, for "armor" at least since good hunter armor is so extremely rare. My calculations show that whatever you do, something important will suffers. This point-juggling isn't exactly fun, and the main reason I'm thinking about the Brigand more... the other is that I'd like to play a character without a pet after one with five pets. Anyway, I have some time to decide, my Summoner must reach Legendary first.

Felexitus
07-24-2006, 04:58 PM
it took me 4 lethal strikes to kill legendary talos. epic typhon always dies to one hit.

feel free to start with traps they are all you need for normal and well into epic, though admittedly that nowhere near being an archer

Viperace
07-24-2006, 10:40 PM
it took me 4 lethal strikes to kill legendary talos. epic typhon always dies to one hit.

feel free to start with traps they are all you need for normal and well into epic, though admittedly that nowhere near being an archer

You must have a very good bow. I can't do that with my current char yet. :knockout:

Anyway, lethal strike is good VS boss, couple it with Study Prey.

I am super advocate of Monster Lure, this skill is plain cheap, works on boss. When you reach late Epic, you can consider puting a couple of points into it and try it for yourself. It draws away alot of firepower that is otherwise directed at you.

Felexitus
07-24-2006, 11:18 PM
i have a spear, i dont think thats even remotely possible with a bow

Viperace
07-24-2006, 11:57 PM
I see, spear will do. I envy my spear max damage which always outnumbered my bow.

Emiraven
07-25-2006, 10:53 AM
Just one note here in case it wasn't made clear:


"Or if Lethal Strike works with a bow or only with melee attacks?"

Lethal Strike does work with bows, but using LS means the arrow won't penetrate to hit targets behind the first monster. At least, I've never seen it work.

ScottyBones
07-25-2006, 11:14 PM
Just one note here in case it wasn't made clear:



Lethal Strike does work with bows, but using LS means the arrow won't penetrate to hit targets behind the first monster. At least, I've never seen it work.


I've never seen LS pass through enemies neither.

Viperace
07-25-2006, 11:21 PM
LS will not pass through enemies of course!
Arrows passing through mob is from the Marksman->Punctured Shot tree,

Lethal Strike OR Marksman, choose one only :D

Ieldra
07-26-2006, 03:48 AM
Lethal Strike OR Marksman, choose one only :D
So, how does it work? Is it a separate attack, like a spell? Do you use it in place of your main attack? If not, then there isn't a reason why it shouldn't work together with the Marksman skill.

Viperace
07-26-2006, 05:06 AM
Ok ok.

Both Lethal Strike and Marksmanship are Active skill.

Marksmanship is a Left-click skill, you can keep casting it, no cooldown. How fast you can cast it depends on your Attack Speed.

Lethal Strike cannot be apply on your LMB, it is not a main attack skill. Thats mainly because it has around 12second cooldown. You don't want your main attack skill to have that long cooldown o.0
It works like a spell too, activate it, click a target, then bling!

So, both LS and Marksman works like a spell, you choose either one of them, not both.


For example a boss fight.
Marksman,Marksman,Marksman,Marksman,Lethal Strike,Marksman,Marksman,...