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Damballah
07-05-2006, 07:42 PM
Title says it. Currently Im using a conjurer (still a ternion build but using the core dweller and vol orb for alot of trash mob clearing).

Anyone else using this setup? Why is the 'uber' build for ternion always considered (at least from what I have read) to be paired with storm.

Base dps wise the earth enchant is a few points more. Is it because of the wisp? 100% elemental but with volatilty you get a 33% chance of 178% (on top of the 100% earth enchant gives vs the 78% static charge gives you) plus with earth you get a chance of burn. I realize volatility is only 33% chance but when messing with melee chars I've see things with far less % proc alot.

Just curious here.

Weavols
07-05-2006, 08:33 PM
Is it because of the wisp? 100% elemental but with volatilty you get a 33% chance of 178% (on top of the 100% earth enchant gives vs the 78% static charge gives you) plus with earth you get a chance of burn.

From what I understand the +% from earth enchant adds to burn damage not fire. It would still work with ternion if you had any burn adds but it wouldn't be multiplying the base damage of a fire staff like storm nimbus does. Also the direct cold/lightning adds from storm nimbus go in as base along with the staff. With all the multipliers being added to base, a little goes a loooong way. Some other usefull things about storm like the resistance debuff and general archer destruction of squall. Either build will do nice damage with enough int but at it's highest storm will likely hit twice as hard with ternion. My highest ternion so far is 15k, get to 48 and compare!:> (battle marker/eye of storm/mob debuffed by squall + liche king).

Damballah
07-05-2006, 08:57 PM
Can anyone confirm the % from earth only adding to burn dmg? I see brimstone adds a % chance for burn dmg but if we are discussing the raw % added from the base earth its listed the same as the 76% from nimbus. I've tried the each enchant out and if you are discussing base as displayed by 'dps' on the character screen each enchant adds there as well. Fire seems to be a few dps higher (just going off of enchant, not counting wisp, etc.) but its hard to gauge since fire staves dont have a range of dmg (ie 10 base vs 7-13 base).

Weavols
07-05-2006, 09:36 PM
I see brimstone adds a % chance for burn dmg but if we are discussing the raw % added from the base earth its listed the same as the 76% from nimbus. I've tried the each enchant out and if you are discussing base as displayed by 'dps' on the character screen each enchant adds there as well.

When you mouseover the skill does it say +X% to fire damage? if it does then you're golden. I'm just going by what the list on gamebanshee says as I haven't made an earth char since the demo. When I say base damage I mean the amount listed on the staff as well as numeric adds (not %). The damage formula has several multipliers in line, so any increase to the first number in the chain has a large end result. If the skill is only adding burn damage it would still show up in the displayed Avg damage and Dps but that damage wont scale in the same way as an increase in base when you're focusing on 1 element. Int will help both, but +fire gear wont.

Damballah
07-05-2006, 09:43 PM
Yeah its +100% fire damage.

Damballah
07-05-2006, 09:51 PM
Oh and when I equip Brimstone (ring that adds +19% fire damage and among other things) it also ups my dps with a fire staff when earth enchant is up.

Weavols
07-05-2006, 09:55 PM
Should be comparable then. You would miss a little base damage from having a burn add as opposed to lightning and the prometheus flame relic adding burn instead as well (compared to zeus thunderbolt). End game you'll probably favor int % gear over fire %. As for the whisp buff it's really only active for boss battles anyway. The mobs just die too fast for him to get into combat. Dmg might feel kinda streaky with the procs but i fully condone this build:P core dweller rox.

psikosis
07-05-2006, 10:16 PM
It is fire dmg not burn dmg.

235

Weavols
07-05-2006, 10:32 PM
sweet. It's even base fire. The race is on! make sure you cap out lich king for his resist debuff nuke eventually. Wouldn't be surprised if a hit from both procs could top me.

Neverwinter27
07-05-2006, 11:16 PM
I would think the Oracle is the better class. Storm's summon doesnt need alot of points invested to be good, and its just as durable as the core dweller, also Storm has two types of elemental damage, giving a versatility advantage in the later difficulties with certain elemental immunes. Finally, I think the storm tree has more useful skills overall.

Damballah
07-05-2006, 11:30 PM
Well I like the core dweller taking hits for me. My dodging skills just aren't what they used to be :P I like fire. And everyone is an oracle .... no offense to oracles at all I just want to do something a little different (though Im still a ternion whore)

Neverwinter27
07-05-2006, 11:49 PM
its all about the ternion attack in the end...and to anyone who was wondering what ternion meant, it means three.

Substandard
07-06-2006, 02:06 AM
I absolutely love my Conjurer so far... I'm only in the mid 20's, but Volcanic Orb is great, the Core Dweller rocks, and Ternion attack is fantastic. These are pretty much what I have all my points in, but I'm having 0 problems so far.

I could see the 2 different elements being nice for storm, particularly if the later enemies go the way of Diablo and are totally immune to some types of magic.

On the flip side, with an Oracle you are forced to find all +elemental stuff or make either ice or lightning weak with storm. It seems like most of the stuff I've found has been either + ice or + lightning. I like being able to use all +fire

I've died all of 1 time so far, and it's pretty rare I even use any potions, but I hear it gets to be a lot tougher later on.

I can't imagine anything being too much better than VO and Ternion though.

twylight
07-06-2006, 02:11 AM
I have them both in epic - core > storm guys for tanking (he is an agro producing insane fire throwing beast)

Agro best = core
DPS best = cant tell
Tanking best = maybe wisp cause of dodge at 99, core never close to dying tho

Either way the core walker is critical to getting agro so you dont die in one volley in epic+.

I even tried him against a bugged outsider - crushed it in all aspects except dps for the first 30 seconds til the outsider was out of mana.

DPS is sick on both on toons. Earth buff affects staff fire damage just fine

ScottyBones
07-06-2006, 02:16 AM
I absolutely love my Conjurer so far... I'm only in the mid 20's, but Volcanic Orb is great, the Core Dweller rocks, and Ternion attack is fantastic. These are pretty much what I have all my points in, but I'm having 0 problems so far.

I could see the 2 different elements being nice for storm, particularly if the later enemies go the way of Diablo and are totally immune to some types of magic.

On the flip side, with an Oracle you are forced to find all +elemental stuff or make either ice or lightning weak with storm. It seems like most of the stuff I've found has been either + ice or + lightning. I like being able to use all +fire

I've died all of 1 time so far, and it's pretty rare I even use any potions, but I hear it gets to be a lot tougher later on.

I can't imagine anything being too much better than VO and Ternion though.


With oracle you can weapon switch between cold and lightning damaging staves thus effectively using two of the three elements. Let's not even talk about the wisp and eye of the storm. I like both builds though and will be trying a conjurer very soon.

Jack McCandless
07-06-2006, 02:22 AM
The thing about the Core Dweller isn't so much the durability, it's the durability combined with his innate ability, Provoke. If you mouse over the first icon under a summoned core dweller's stat bar, it will say something like "provoke: draws enemy attention". As far as I know it's the only minion with this type of power; wolves don't have it. So while any minion can draw attention with attacks, the core dweller is the only one that does it as a natural talent. He can soak more aggro, he can pull stray hostiles off you much more successfully.